Hardin Marine Cheyenne

blazeracer

New member
There's been plenty of dyno test that will confirm, a carb is just as good if not a little better at time at WOT. EFI is more efficient in most all other area, but for WOT in jet boat, carb will do this time.

Could have done EFI but unlike the last motor, this one's doens't have all the compatible equipment needed. I would need to get a drive by cable TB and harness with the correct ECM to control it all, then add an OBD-II port and check engine light. We'll just the throw a carb and an MSD-6LS on it and run with it. Keep it simple this time.

Oh hey, if anyone has an HTP straight snoot, this boat's got a double drilled droop I'll be happy to trade for.
 

Devilman

Well-known member
what would be the point of changing the pump hardware before even getting it wet? Seems like you'd at least want to run it & get a baseline on its performance first. I guess it'll come out in the wash either way....
 

FormulaZR

New member
blazeracer said:
Thanks guys. Scored the power plant today. No junk yard dawg this time. This is an all aluminum true LS1 with CNC ported AFR heads pullled from a Vette with 67k on the clock that chassis dyno'd 440hp at the tires. Proven engine ready for action.

Gonna sell the EFI sh!t and run a carb on this one.

Very cool. Some words of advice, but you can ignore them if you want.

1) The aluminum block engines need to run at least 160*, and ideally in the 180* range. Any less and they are losing power - and potentially longevity.
2) With the tunnel hull, you will likely need to run a remote oil filter - and possibly a top mount starter. You'll find out soon enough, but do look for clearance in those areas.
3) I'd very much recommend a rod bolt upgrade. You're getting up there in horsepower, and probably in revs. Cheap insurance.
4) Get a single plane manifold. I'd skip the Performer RPM and Victor Jr. Look at a Super Vic or GMPP manifold.
5) Whether you run open or closed cooling, I'd make sure to run at least 1 coolant crossover, if not 2. It helps eliminate hot spots in the top of the heads.
6) With the higher compression of the LS1, I'd limit max timing to 28-29* total. Being AFR heads, 29* will probably be spot on. You probably won't see any gains above that anyways...but you could (VERY likely) have some detonation issues with 30*+. The timing curve should be something like 14* from 0-1500 rpm, then ramping to 25* at about 2200-2500 rpm, then ramping to 29* at 3000-3200 rpm where it stays until the rev limit. You *might* need to back it off to 28* at about 5200+ rpm.
7) LS engines for some reason love big carbs. It doesn't make sense...but something in the 800-850 range is probably what you want. I tried a 700, 750, 800, and 850 cfm on mine. It liked the 850 the best. I never tried a bigger carb than 850 cfm.
8) My testing has shown that tunnels really like back cut shoes. Even with the lighter weight of the aluminum engine, my boat runs very well with a 2* back cut. I'd limit mouth opening to somewhere around 14".
9) You might also look at the trunion upgrade for the rockers. With sustained high rpm it would be cheap insurance.


As for carb vs EFI. I can guarantee that you will make more power above 5300 rpm with a Super Vic than you will a Fast 90/90 combo. You will lose some driveability and the super easy start, but will definitely gain power if jetted correctly. In some ways, I have regretted going EFI - and that's why I will be trying 2 new EFI manifolds when summer gets here.


** Incidentally - I might sell my Super Victor, MSD 6010, and Demon 850. Not sure...but if you're interested, let me know. I am also going to try my HTP straight snoot back to back this summer against my droop. If it doesn't help, it'll be for sale. It's powdercoated black.
 

blazeracer

New member
Here's the Cheyenne history as far as the information I have gotten. The first Cheyenne was created, probably splashed from a Brendella, by Fineline Industries in the mid 80's. They didn't make many but those were the first. Then Hardin got the molds, changed the deck and laid em up for a couple of years with help from Tom Papp. After that the molds were sold to Jimmy Dominique where they sat for a few years and not one got laid up. Next was Jay Ernst who brokered the deal for Irvin Capps to make the Cheyenne's in the mid to late 90's.
 

blazeracer

New member
Hey Zach, I'll be running a Demon 850 on mine. I have a 4 way crossover for the heads. I need to take a pic of it and get a part number on it. I won't know on rob bolts till I get the oil pan off. It very well may have ARP's in it already seeing the cam and head work that's already in this motor. It came out of a 2001 Vette that was insurance totaled and parted out as a result of a theft recovery.

What you want for the Victor and MSD? I got my own Demon.
 

FormulaZR

New member
blazeracer said:
What you want for the Victor and MSD? I got my own Demon.

If I decide to sell I'll probably be looking for around $600 for them. I think they are around $865 new.
 

Last Mohecian

Administrator
blazeracer said:
EO, I need a SS impeller cut down from an A to a B.

Man.  You sure you don't want to trade for this stainless B/C I have?  Actually mine needs to be measured.  EO thought it was a B/C by looking at it.  You are welcome to try it and if it works for you we could trade.  If it does not work for you then you could get yours cut.

I just hate to see you cut that stainless A down before you even try it in the boat.  You can always cut it down later but it is real hard to add it back.
 

blazeracer

New member
Well, unknown factors came up, as usual, so the impeller is staying as is for now. I don't think I can use your impeller. I would love to try a B/C but I got a funky 3/4" wear ring that's unique and only an imp with same type of wear ring can used. Garry Snow called it a labyrinth wear ring.
 

Last Mohecian

Administrator
blazeracer said:
Well, unknown factors came up, as usual, so the impeller is staying as is for now. I don't think I can use your impeller. I would love to try a B/C but I got a funky 3/4" wear ring that's unique and only an imp with same type of wear ring can used. Garry Snow called it a labyrinth wear ring.

I have a matched wear ring for mine.
 

blazeracer

New member
The kind with the ridges, like this?? I wanted to try out my C imp but it won't even go in.

Video from today.. did some cleaning.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M8W5tg6OD8Y&feature=youtu.be
 

Last Mohecian

Administrator
blazeracer said:
The kind with the ridges, like this?? I wanted to try out my C imp but it won't even go in.

Video from today.. did some cleaning.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M8W5tg6OD8Y&feature=youtu.be

I do have one like that but it is not for the stainless impeller I have.  I do have a wear ring that is matched to my stainless impeller.  We can discuss on Saturday.
 
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