21 Liberator build

[YMeLord]

Newbie .. but not new to projects.

99 Liberator 21' .. appears to be a theft recovery as it's completely stripped.


Found in Georgia and saved from someone that initially had intentions of cutting up and converting to a flats fishing boat ... So get her home and start investigating how much work it really is going to need. Transom / side bulkheads / Dash wood and side rail wood. Pretty much anywhere wood was ... will have to be redone. So time to get dirty. Decision was made to take the back deck cap off so we can make sure the transom gets removed right and reinstalled right. I KNOW ... some of you are probably staring at your screen with your mouth open far enough that a buzzard could fly in ... but there's very good reasons why we went this way. Here the main reason why.

Don't have a pic (you'll see why later) of the other reason but will have in a couple of days.
So the cap comes off. Didn't take but about 2 hours to have most of the 2 piece transom out. Then ... "Houston we have a problem" ... while cutting literally the last piece of glass to start removing the second half of the transom ... cutoff wheel binds ... walks up the transom ... and decides to make mince meat of my wrist. PROJECT ON HOLD until this thing heals.

In the meantime .. this allows me some time to start the project thread like I promised Cliff a while back. Plans are to get back on it SOME this weekend.

Plans for this are to naturally redo all the wood that is rotten... redo the transom for an outdrive (Blackhawk on the way) ... flip it and blueprint the bottom / regel ... then flip and regel (multi-color) the top.  Powerplant for this will start off as (most likely) a semi stock ls engine to get to the water .. but by sometime next year .. plans are to build a blown (8.71) 6.0 LS. This should interest FormulaZR and Blazeracer to say the least.

I'll try and keep this updated as much as I can but since I have a 9-5 ... work will only take place on the weekends so progress will be slower than some other builds. I should have some more pics if nothing else come Monday or Tuesday.

 

[Knotty Girl]

This sounds interesting keep us posted.  clap.gif

 

[jimsplace]

I'm sure this will start a discussion, but why an LS?

LS's are good motors when used in the right applications. Performance boats don't tend to be one of them.
Two things boats like are horsepower and torque.  A BBC has proven to be one of the best.  There are
many parts available and are relatively inexpensive when compared to most other motors.

Put a large cubic inch BBC in it and you'll end up with a better running boat.
Ninety percent of the performance boats today have BBC motors and there's a reason.
    :smile17:

 

[FormulaZR]

This thread has my name all over it.


I'm going to tag this for later. I'll be back, but I'm in no condition to post tonight.



In the meantime: I see you are planning a Blackhawk (hope you have props?). What's your speed/performance goal? Also...what's the engine budget. You don't need much power to go fast with a Blackhawk...


As for the above post. Some choose traditional powerplants, others choose...well...

Two roads diverged in a wood, and I—
I took the one less traveled by,
And that has made all the difference.

 

[jimsplace]

This thread has my name all over it.


I'm going to tag this for later. I'll be back, but I'm in no condition to post tonight.



In the meantime: I see you are planning a Blackhawk (hope you have props?). What's your speed/performance goal? Also...what's the engine budget. You don't need much power to go fast with a Blackhawk...


As for the above post. Some choose traditional powerplants, others choose...well...

Two roads diverged in a wood, and I—
I took the one less traveled by,
And that has made all the difference.

Hey, I don't have a problem with anyone trying something different.
If it makes the builder happy, thats all that matters as long as they
go into a project knowing the benefits and are aware of any potential limitations.

I'll be interested in knowing how the project turns out.  There are certainly some
on these boards that have played with using the LS motors and had pretty decent
results.
  :smile17:

 

[duanehydro]

Very intense build...be cool to see it come along!! clap.gif

 

[Crusader]

Big blocks, though proven, are dinosaurs. I'm willing to bet in 20 years the Big block motor will be a thing of the past with LS / Coyote type motors taking their place.

 

[Patchman]

Gonna be a cool build thread! I can't wait to see the progress! clap.gif :smile16:

 

[YMeLord]

I'm sure this will start a discussion, but why an LS?

LS's are good motors when used in the right applications. Performance boats don't tend to be one of them.
Two things boats like are horsepower and torque.  A BBC has proven to be one of the best.  There are
many parts available and are relatively inexpensive when compared to most other motors.

Put a large cubic inch BBC in it and you'll end up with a better running boat.
Ninety percent of the performance boats today have BBC motors and there's a reason.
    :smile17:

Jim ... I actually thought about a BBC ... the LS platform is one that we are familiar with ... have a pair in a buddy's 24' Skater and very pleased with all around performance. Not to say we might not get surprised with an issue or 2 ... but for the most part .. pretty confident in what we'll get. Not to mention ... why be like everyone else?

This thread has my name all over it.


I'm going to tag this for later. I'll be back, but I'm in no condition to post tonight.



In the meantime: I see you are planning a Blackhawk (hope you have props?). What's your speed/performance goal? Also...what's the engine budget. You don't need much power to go fast with a Blackhawk...


As for the above post. Some choose traditional powerplants, others choose...well...

Two roads diverged in a wood, and I—
I took the one less traveled by,
And that has made all the difference.

Hey, I don't have a problem with anyone trying something different.
If it makes the builder happy, thats all that matters as long as they
go into a project knowing the benefits and are aware of any potential limitations.

I'll be interested in knowing how the project turns out.  There are certainly some
on these boards that have played with using the LS motors and had pretty decent
results.
  :smile17:

I knew you'd have interest in this ...

Big blocks, though proven, are dinosaurs. I'm willing to bet in 20 years the Big block motor will be a thing of the past with LS / Coyote type motors taking their place.

I have to agree with you Cliff.

Let it be known ... I have NEVER been known for doing things the logical or normal way ... like to be thinking "out of the box" so I'm sure we'll make some (as deemed by others) mistakes or senseless efforts ... 

Got some more pics from Sunday's work ... will get them up sometime in the next day or so.

 

[Crusader]

Looking forward to the pics YML!!

 

[Carnivalride]

Big blocks, though proven, are dinosaurs. I'm willing to bet in 20 years the Big block motor will be a thing of the past with LS / Coyote type motors taking their place.

On budget builds I'll agree but if the budget is there with all the aftermarket parts available I don't see the current LS platform out performing the "aftermarket dinosaur" platform with the same boost or nitrous. Cubic inches mean torque and there are heads out there that let 555+ CID breath. Power to weight and price I think the. LS will be a winner but overall power potential I seriously doubt.

Just my $.02

 

[FormulaZR]

On budget builds I'll agree but if the budget is there with all the aftermarket parts available I don't see the current LS platform out performing the "aftermarket dinosaur" platform with the same boost or nitrous. Cubic inches mean torque and there are heads out there that let 555+ CID breath. Power to weight and price I think the. LS will be a winner but overall power potential I seriously doubt.

Just my $.02

You're 100% correct on this. Even though I think the LS is a great platform, and with a big budget can be a 500 ci monster...it'll still NEVER be able to make the same kind of power you see out of a 540+ BBC. For instance...take a look at the Sunset Racecraft Pro series 632 at 1320 hp (all motor).

I personally think the LS is a perfect option for those who are looking for 300-700 horsepower, maybe even up to 900 horsepower. I know an LS can make more than 900...but I personally wouldn't want that engine in my boat.

Last time I was out at Lake Alan Henry, I burned 15 gallons of fuel in 3.5 hours...and never had it below 3500 rpm.




YMeLord...were you with Tim at Tawakoni, or is this another friend? With the experience from Tim's boat, I can't see how you'll run into too much that you haven't already dealt with. That Skater runs very nice...I see no reason why this Liberator won't as well.

 

[FL350]

Big blocks, though proven, are dinosaurs. I'm willing to bet in 20 years the Big block motor will be a thing of the past with LS / Coyote type motors taking their place.

Suuurrreee they will crazy.gif crazy.gif

 

[Crusader]

Lol.

 

[mr rogers]

you know cliff there are several dinosaurs that are members on here. i wont say any names like Henry, but i would hate to see them get there feelings hurt.  JK  :evil:

 

[Crusader]

I'm a big fan of the dinos!!! They're great... Just stating what the trends seem to be.

 

[YMeLord]

On budget builds I'll agree but if the budget is there with all the aftermarket parts available I don't see the current LS platform out performing the "aftermarket dinosaur" platform with the same boost or nitrous. Cubic inches mean torque and there are heads out there that let 555+ CID breath. Power to weight and price I think the. LS will be a winner but overall power potential I seriously doubt.

Just my $.02

You're 100% correct on this. Even though I think the LS is a great platform, and with a big budget can be a 500 ci monster...it'll still NEVER be able to make the same kind of power you see out of a 540+ BBC. For instance...take a look at the Sunset Racecraft Pro series 632 at 1320 hp (all motor).

I personally think the LS is a perfect option for those who are looking for 300-700 horsepower, maybe even up to 900 horsepower. I know an LS can make more than 900...but I personally wouldn't want that engine in my boat.

Last time I was out at Lake Alan Henry, I burned 15 gallons of fuel in 3.5 hours...and never had it below 3500 rpm.




YMeLord...were you with Tim at Tawakoni, or is this another friend? With the experience from Tim's boat, I can't see how you'll run into too much that you haven't already dealt with. That Skater runs very nice...I see no reason why this Liberator won't as well.

That was me ... shelved the Eliminator project in lieu of a better platform to start with.

I could say I'll put a 318 mopar in it ... would anyone mind that?  crazy.gif :smile17:

Honestly .. the LS platform will do most anything I need it to judging on the experience with the Skater. And I don't need the torque a BBC provides ... if anything with this Blackhawk ... I'd be wanting to kill some of the torque out of it .. so why not go with a platform that will have the HP ... and not have the issues with the huge torque traditionally known of BBC builds... not to mention save a TON of weight. Won't be the quickest nor the fastest on the water ... but should turn some heads and maybe even tick off a couple of BBC's.  think.gif

I just see a ton of BBC boats ... want to be not so much like the others. Grandpa told me a long time ago ... "Boy ... you ain't right" .. guess I'm trying to live up to his expectations.

 

[FormulaZR]

Honestly .. the LS platform will do most anything I need it to judging on the experience with the Skater. And I don't need the torque a BBC provides ... if anything with this Blackhawk ... I'd be wanting to kill some of the torque out of it .. so why not go with a platform that will have the HP ... and not have the issues with the huge torque traditionally known of BBC builds... not to mention save a TON of weight. Won't be the quickest nor the fastest on the water ... but should turn some heads and maybe even tick off a couple of BBC's.  think.gif

Plus...the LS should be one of the easiest engine to get a very low idle rpm out of. As I understand, that is very important with a Blackhawk for a reasonable no wake/docking speed.

 

[jimsplace]

I'll have to put the "dinosaur" comment in same category as those that talked about a paperless society 20 years ago because of computers. Ha.
An LS motor is and always will be a small motor.
If anyone wants to use the 500" LS motor as an example, then compare it to a 632" BBC or maybe even the spread bore 800" motors.
They are, or at least border on being an expensive exotic motor.

There are BBC's making over 2000 horsepower on a regular basis. 
The LS guys talk about maybe a 1000 horsepower from an exotic naturally aspirated motor or 1500 blown.
Horsepower is still horsepower.
It can be done, with enough money.
Who wants to be first?
  think.gif

 

[Knotty Girl]

you know cliff there are several dinosaurs that are members on here. i wont say any names like Henry, but i would hate to see them get there feelings hurt.  JK  :evil:

Where you referring to me or my boat  think.gif Oh well both are correct.  :smile27: